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Why AGF.io is broken and how to fix it
#1
Why AGF.io is broken and how to fix it

I play on the North American "SOLO AGF.io" server since it has been started and almost on a daily basis. This qualifies me to make a suggestion how to repair the mechanics of this server, that are unfortunately broken.

What is broken?

Creating viruses by shooting them. This can be done in different ways, however, with the help of auto ejecting and when having enough mass, it is possible to create and eat new viruses extremly fast. This is basically the same technique that can be used on the VirusFarm servers. The idea is to hold w and aim on a little group of viruses. When having enough mass, new viruses will constantly spawn and be eaten by the player's cells. This allows to get from the minimum mass (which is for average skilled players around 3000 mass) up to more than 35000 mass just within seconds (30 maybe, when done well).

The described technique is easy to learn and nowadays widely known. Beginners can get big in no time. They then can keep on virus fast farming. By doing this, cells that are much smaller de facto cant beat them and its extremly difficult and also random to steal mass from them. Thew problem is that they cannot be effectively virused, since they virus them self without interruption. They can easily shoot viruses to attackers. Their cells occassionally increase their mass extremly (when hit by  a lot of viruses) and then eat nearby players. Also i is possible for the virus farming  player to move while virus fast farming. Also fast self-feeding is still possible.

Therefore virus fast farming can only effectively fought by cells that have around max(3k mass / 20% mass of the virus farmers mass) . Even then it is risky, therefore to attack a player who knows how to use the advantages of fast virus farming, even much more mass is needed. This means the other player has to a) go the hard way and eat other players or b) has to do virus farming themself - isn't that ironic?

Also AGF.io has only a small map (14000 x 8000 units). Virus fast farming allows a single and skilled player to dominate the server, by using virus spamming (using w to shoot viruses extremly often, kinda constantly) and savaging other players and using virus fast farming again and again to keep the amount of mass big.

While players do virus fast farming, other players often cannot shoot viruses. Therefore the virus fast farming of a single player affects all other players and damages the virus shooting mechanic.


Why is it broken?

Virus fast farming in AGF.io is without a doubt overpowered. Even beginners can use it to get great advantages. 
Virus fast farming can be abused by teamers to keep the amount of their mass high. Therefore virus fast farming counters the anti teaming mechanics of the server.

How could it be fixed?

I assume that there are several ways to fix this broken mechanic. The most simple yet effctive idea I have is to set the mass added to a cell by a virus when eaten to 0 for players with more than 5000 mass. 5000 is only an estimation, an initial value, and perhaps has to be reduced to a lower value.

(Note: Virus fast farming is not in generally bad, the problem is that it gives too much mass in a small server like AGF.io. Even when the mass it gives is reduced it can be abused by teamers, however, solo palyers have much better chances to fight back.)

Why it has to be fixed?

The current mechanic support teamers. In the past and the presence solo players have found advanced ways to fight teamers, primarily by targeting them. There even had been a group of players forged for the only reason to fight teamers. Since AGF.io is young and the virus fast farming technique was not that widely known during the early days of the problem, the resistance against palyers who abuse this technique is small. Today. However, the mentioned examples are clear warnings not to underestimate the consequences if this problem continues to exist. I also want to remind that @Sora cleary said that teaming is not allowed on AGF.io and that there might be consequences to teaming. So far, there are none. Solo players should not be forced to handle this problem on their own.



Example of virus fast farming:
[Image: pkmzi7k7l.png]

Example of a player with about 25000 mass after virus farming (remember, much more is possible):
[Image: 264jje.png]
Notice the size of the player in comparison to the map size and the size of the field of vision. The player can see the whole map when near to its center. This helps to kill players that try to fight them while they are small.
[-] The following 4 users Like samira's post:
  • Démone, DoctorFinkle, Sora, Squirrel
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#2
I agree with you Samira, I agree that players can get far too much mass on this small server (30 to 35k in a few seconds when done well) using the farming virus and indeed, many use now, you explained it correctly . People who know me know that I would be tempted to say that I would completely remove this '' thing '' .... ( ;P) but to keep the game balanced and maybe to help  ''novice players'' get some extra mass I can understand that this '' thing '' can become a way for them. Why not make a compromise for everyone half way ..  15k.... i don't know .. But what bothers me a bit is when I try to virus a virus farm user, I can not always use the virus near this one, the virus does not shoot and it would be nice if we could do it and make the farming virus certainly less frustrating. 

Personnaly, when I see good players using this '' thing '' to get their mass or use it in full battle, I wonder to know ... are they really such good players as they claim ... and do they really need that ?? It's my simple perception! no offense! Or maybe I do not care as much as they do about my mass .......; -) or rather that I prefer to work harder to get my mass again  Big Grin Big Grin Big Grin I am stubborn !!! And proud to be!    Cool Tongue

In fact ... this '' thing'' is just boring lol  Heart
[-] The following 2 users Like Démone's post:
  • samira, Squirrel
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#3
I agree that virus farming is broken and it needs to be fixed. It is overpowered on a grand level, both offensively and defensively. Farmers get really large really quickly and it is near impossible to stop a farmer because if you split to try to eat them, you get obliterated by their viruses, and if you try to pop them, nothing happens because they are at max split. This obviously needs to be fixed, but the question is HOW to fix it. I have heard many people say to remove farming entirely, but I do not like this because I believe the mechanic itself has some great benefits without being inherently overpowering. Virus battles are a big part of the game, and the virus mechanics on Agf.io is part of what separates this server from others, being fast-paced. I like the idea of reducing virus mass, but this can take different forms. The mass could be reduced for players more than a certain size, as you said, but I think it should be reduced for PIECES more than a certain size. A strategy that I like to use is to eat a virus, let all of my tiny pieces join except for one, and use that extra piece to pop other players. Other strategies people use with tiny pieces include baiting, etc. I think this extra piece should be treated as another player, so even if you are at 20k and your smaller piece is at 50, the smaller piece can gain mass from viruses. Smaller pieces should also only gain mass if it eats a still virus, not one that is shot from a bigger piece. Even then, there may still be loopholes, and any plan to fix the server should be done carefully and test-ran.

P.S. I see me!  Big Grin
[-] The following 4 users Like DoctorFinkle's post:
  • Démone, samira, Squirrel , yukichan
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#4
(12-13-2019, 04:37 AM)Démone Wrote: Personnaly, when I see good players using this '' thing '' to get their mass or use it in full battle, I wonder to know ... are they really such good players as they claim ... and do they really need that ?? It's my simple perception! no offense! Or maybe I do not care as much as they do about my mass .......; -) or rather that I prefer to work harder to get my mass again  Big Grin Big Grin Big Grin I am stubborn !!! And proud to be!    Cool Tongue

I agree completely!

What makes a true 'good player' is the skill they use to play the game, as the game intended, to eat other players.

And their knowledge of the game, and shortcuts that can be used to become a huge force at a certain time on a server, does not at all represent 'skill'.

Hopefully @Sora figures out how to balance this!
Fight the Good Fight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PigupJKlOk
Make it worth the price we pay!
(Lyrics: http://www.metrolyrics.com/fight-the-goo...iumph.html)
[-] The following 3 users Like Squirrel 's post:
  • Démone, samira, yukichan
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#5
Since nothing happened, not even the tiniest response (as it was to be expected), I unfortunately have no other choice than "solving" the problem on my own.

Unfair players do not deserve fair play, so I will use unfair methods to correct the balance.

The Agma staff won't like them but their "we don't care at all" attiude forces me to do this.

I accept whatever the consequences may be.

Mark this date, it's the day when the horizon started to darken... doomsday will come!
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#6
I mean, don't ever expect much here lol
[Image: giphy.gif]
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#7
(12-21-2019, 12:26 AM)samira Wrote: Since nothing happened, not even the tiniest response (as it was to be expected), I unfortunately have no other choice than "solving" the problem on my own.

Unfair players do not deserve fair play, so I will use unfair methods to correct the balance.

The Agma staff won't like them but their "we don't care at all" attiude forces me to do this.

I accept whatever the consequences may be.

Mark this date, it's the day when the horizon started to darken... doomsday will come!

Sounds just like Miniclip and agario.



[Image: giphy.gif][Image: giphy.gif][Image: giphy.gif][Image: giphy.gif]
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#8
(12-21-2019, 12:26 AM)samira Wrote: Since nothing happened, not even the tiniest response (as it was to be expected), I unfortunately have no other choice than "solving" the problem on my own.

Unfair players do not deserve fair play, so I will use unfair methods to correct the balance.

The Agma staff won't like them but their "we don't care at all" attiude forces me to do this.

I accept whatever the consequences may be.

Mark this date, it's the day when the horizon started to darken... doomsday will come!

You should definitely audition for one of Marvel's "Bad-censored" women characters! I would go see your movie, and hey if I'm lucky, maybe you'll make a video of the tempest that is on the horizon!

Oh, hmm, in a way, aren't I kind of like Agma Staff? 'Staff' on the Discord server, a 'Mod' in the game, and with spam-removal abilities here?? Of course, I can't do anything to fix the problem whereof you speak.

I hope that you will give them some time to respond. You know all too well that some programming tasks are harder than others! And, not having seen the code of the game, I doubt you can predict anyone's programming styles!

Ahh well... call me crazy, but thus far, I have not minded seeing you mad. (Except once, when you were mad at me. lol)
Fight the Good Fight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PigupJKlOk
Make it worth the price we pay!
(Lyrics: http://www.metrolyrics.com/fight-the-goo...iumph.html)
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#9
Yeah but I am mad. I know it needs a Long Time but since there was no reaction at all I can’t wait much longer. However I will stop when I can.. so there is still Time since what i have in mind needs a lot of preparation. I will start with that preparation tomorrow.
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#10
(12-21-2019, 04:37 AM)samira Wrote: Yeah but I am mad. I know it needs a Long Time but since there was no reaction at all I can’t wait much longer. However I will stop when I can.. so there is still Time since what i have in mind needs a lot of preparation. I will start with that preparation tomorrow.

@Sora

How about it...? Are there any plans here?

I tease her about liking to see her mad... but I'd rather not see her mad at 'the game' itself/

It might be time to atleast acknowledge... is there a problem? And have you had any thoughts on what needs to be done?

It sounds like she wants to play just this, and she can't... because people are taking advantage of the status quo.

Do I need to rummage through my exes place, and dig out ye olde C++ books? (lol)

And if not, can we at least get some of that cool fire-axphyxiating foam to cover her with, maybe make her look like some bizarre B-grade horror flick animated snowwoman?!
Fight the Good Fight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PigupJKlOk
Make it worth the price we pay!
(Lyrics: http://www.metrolyrics.com/fight-the-goo...iumph.html)
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  • Sora
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